Ben Abrahamson posted to We Oppose Homosexuality
2 people like this.
Mateen Yousuf Thanks17 hours ago
Ishfaq Wani @ben dear brother, the problem has spread becoz the laws have been in favour of this evil. All relegions of the world r against this evil. Its solution is given by isjam just to stone the persons to death so that, so that the one who thinks of doing the crime will move backward by thinking on its pment16 hours ago via Facebook Mobile · 1 person- Ben Abrahamson It is also possible that it has spread because of the wide availability of pornography to children, and other cultural laxities. Surely a portion of the people who become involved with this are not doing it out of choice, but because they have become trapped in a web of culture and fashion that pushes them into it. In this case, for the sake of having mercy on the children who are misled, we need to provide explanations, counter research, and counseling on how to understand and avoid this problem.16 hours ago · 2 people
- Ishfaq Wani i agree with u ben, but the time u apply the islamic law on this evil, the results will cm fastly, but on those who oppose these laws just becoz its name starts with the word islam16 hours ago via Facebook Mobile · 1 person
- Ben Abrahamson Judaism has the same law. But in my humble opinion, religious law is part of a whole system of leadership, government, education, culture and tradition. To apply the law without the education may result in an imbalance, and in the end - although it may accomplish the goal of providing a deterrent - it may inspire hate, rebellion and disrespect for religion. This organization (which I do not know personally) seems to try to educate people and work to prevent the problem in the first place, when it first begins.16 hours ago · 1 person
- Ben Abrahamson If culture, fashion and trends are a factor in pushing people in this direction - even against their choice, perhaps it would be worthwhile to attack the problem on those grounds.16 hours ago · 1 person
Glenda Faye Salaam Peace: Brother Ishfaq Wani: You said: "Its solution is given by isjam just to stone the persons to death so that, so that the one who thinks of doing the crime will move backward by thinking on its pent.” Where does it say in the Qur’an to stone a person to death for homosexuality? Please, kindly give the ayah to show the proof of this? Thank you kindly! Salaam/ Peace12 hours ago- Glenda Faye Salaam/ Peace Brother Ben Abrahamson, I agree that pornography is at least one root cause of homosexuality. Another root cause is a dysfunctional family: a weak father and a strong mother, and/ or when parents cause the child to take on the other sex through putting a female in male sports and trying to make them take on the role of a male because they didn’t produce a son. Or when there is no female child produced and the mother wanted one, I have also seen the mother work hard and make a male child into a female by dressing her son in dresses, buying him dolls and girl toys, and painting his fingernails pink, and this produced a homosexual son. And his effeminate behaviors, caused other effeminates to him as he grew in age. This masculine behavior also caused the feminine women to the masculine woman. I have studied these two people over years. I believe these two people are products of their environment not their genes.11 hours ago
- Ben Abrahamson This position is supported by the ahadith. "Ibn ‘Abbaas (may Allaah be pleased with him) that the Prophet (may Allah exalt his mention) said: "Whomever you find committing the act of the people of (Prophet) Loot, kill both; the doer and the person to whom it is done." [At-Tirmithi, Abu Daawood, Ibn Maajah, and Ahmad]. Many scholars (may Allah have mercy upon) them quoted the consensus of the companions (may Allah be pleased with them) on this matter. However, only a properly installed and authorized Muslim ruler may implement this punishment.
In the Torah it is based on an actual verse ""[A man] shall not lie with another man as [he would] with a woman, it is a toeba ("abomination")" (Leviticus 18:22). The stated punishment for willful violation is the death penalty. However it requires a warning, multiple witness to the act, and a person sound in body and mind who knowing violates this commandment. It also requires a duly authorized Sanhedrin, which has not existed for 2000 years. Even if there were a Sanhedrin, a punishment would be almost impossible to achieve, so Jewish legal experts have understood the intent of scripture to indicate the very serious nature of the sin.11 hours ago · 2 people - Glenda Faye Are you speaking of the stoning? I know this is in Jewish law, however, I wanted to know the Ayah, specifically? I don’t know that there is one. Thanks!11 hours ago
- Glenda Faye I believe that muslims have been using Jewish law instead of Qur’anic law, thinking it is Qur’anic law, when it comes to stoning for homosexuality.11 hours ago
- Glenda Faye Thank you kindly! I didn’t believe there was a Qur’anic Ayah. So muslims have been stoning other muslims for generations based on Jewish law. This is what I thought. Many blessings for your confirmation. Thank you kindly!11 hours ago
- Glenda Faye I should have said that Muslims are stoning other muslims based on Hadith as opposed to Qur’anic law. It is also a Jewish law to stone for homosexuality. There is no Qur’anic law (or ayah at all ) to stone for homosexuality. Thank you kindly for your help. Many blessings. Thank you! Salaam/ Peace11 hours ago
- Reaz Hossain siter u did not believe hadith of prophet it(stoning) mention in hadith. which ref. Ben says.9 hours ago · 1 person
- Glenda Faye Brother Reaz Hossain: Salaam/ Peace: If a saying is not in the Qur’an, then the saying is not authentic from Allah. If the manmade traditional Hadith and the Qur’an say the same thing, then okay, I will consider this manmade traditional Hadith, however, the Qur’an does not say the same as the manmade traditional Hadith in this case. There is nothing in the Qur’an to back up this manmade traditional Hadith, therefore this manmade traditional Hadith is not authentic. Salaam/ Peace Thank you kindly8 hours ago
- Ishfaq Wani man, i think u have not a depth knowledge of islam. Allah says in quran in no less than 20 times obey Allah and obey the prophet. just as the quran is the part of islam, the sayings of the prophet is also the part of islam. these sayings are infact the commetary of the quran. hope u may understand8 hours ago
- Reaz Hossain ......And whatever the Messenger has given you - take; and what he has forbidden you - refrain from. And fear Allah ; indeed, Allah is severe in penalty. (Quran surat al hashr 59:7) we all believe that Quran till eternity (qiyamah). You says Hadith is man made or there is no sayings of prophet preserved. Thats mean Allah lies (may Alah save save us)8 hours ago
- Reaz Hossain And whatever the Messenger has given you - take; and what he has forbidden you - refrain from. this order of Allah is also applicable today tomorrow and till Qiyamah. thats why Hadith have to preserved otherwise this ayat of Allah is wrong( may Allah save us)8 hours ago · 1 person
- Reaz Hossain Ans about the ayat surat hashr 59:7of Authentic Quran referring to the authentic sunnah8 hours ago · 1 person
- Glenda Faye 59: 7 Yusuf Ali
"What Allah has bestowed on His Messenger (and taken away) from the people of the townships,- belongs to Allah,- to His Messenger and to kindred and orphans, the needy and the wayfarer; In order that it may not (merely) make a circuit between the wealthy among you. So take what the Messenger assigns to you, and deny yourselves that which he withholds from you. And fear Allah; for Allah is strict in Punishment.”8 hours ago · 2 people - Reaz Hossain read carefully...Allah says -take what the messenger assigns to you.. And messenger assigns us the rule about the punishment.8 hours ago
- Glenda Faye Dr. Ghali 59-6-8
"And whatever (spoils) Allah has conceded His Messenger from them, then in no way did you (The pronoun is plure) agitate either horses or riding beasts; (i.e., you did not use cavalry or comelry to take spoils) but Allah gives authority to His Messengers over whomever He decides; and Allah is Ever-Determiner over everything.
59:7
Dr. Ghali
Whatever (spoils) Allah has conceded His Messenger from the population of the towns, then that is for Allah and for the Messenger, and for the near kinsman, and the orphans, and the indigent, and the wayfarer, so that it may not (make) a circuit between the rich among you. And whatever the Messenger brings you, then take it; and whatever he forbids you, then give over. And be pious to Allah; surely Allah is strict in punishment.
59:8
Dr. Ghali
It is (also) for the poor emigrants who were driven out of their homes and riches, seeking Grace from Allah and all-blessed Satisfaction, and vindicating Allah and His Messenger. Those are they who are the sincere.”7 hours ago · 1 person - Glenda Faye Okay, Brother let us look at these three ayahs 59:6-8 together in the context in which these are meant. Allah is speaking here about “SPOILS”= GOODS, Not homosexuality. in ayah 6 you will see the word SPOILS, not homosexuality. Do you see this word? Okay now, we will go to ayah 7. Again, Allah is speaking here of SPOILS and how the SPOILS are to be divided up among the population of the towns people and if it is not divide up properly, Allah will punish with a strict punishment. Nowhere is the word homosexuality mentioned in this ayah anywhere. Do you see the word homosexuality? Okay, me either. Now, I will move on to the ayah 8. In this ayah number 8, Allah is speaking of the poor immigrants who were driven out of their homes and their money and how Allah will vindicate them, but only the sincere ones. Nowhere does the Word of Allah say homosexual or stoning come in any of these three ayahs. I am sorry. I don’t see it. Salaam/ Peace7 hours ago · 1 person
- Ben Abrahamson Glenda Faye, concerning the authority of the ahadith, take a look at my note http://www.facebook.com/no
te.php?note_id=25291070806 8310
Here it is best to keep to the subject.7 hours ago · 1 person - Ben Abrahamson The sin of homosexuality is specifically condemned in the ayat Surat al-A’raaf 7:80-84 and Surat al-Hijr 15:72-76.
The punishment of homosexuality is described in the ahaddith al-Tirmidhi 1456, Ahmad 2915 and elsewhere. The Sahabah were unanimously agreed on the punishment of homosexuals, but they differed as to the manner. Muslims who follow the four Madhabs and Jafari all agree that hadith are an essential part of understanding the Qur'an.
Even if one wishes to disregard the authority of the ahadith, it is still clear from the Qur'an that homosexuality is a grevious error, and should be opposed. A good question to ask is in what manner should it be opposed? Education, healing, or law?7 hours ago · 1 person - Ben Abrahamson I would agree that prevention is better than punishment, which is why I posted this link as an example of what some orthodox Jews have tried to do. What other ideas are possible?7 hours ago
- Glenda Faye Education as you said. I believe is important at an early age. Teaching that homosexuality is a life choice which is unacceptable. And if there are any issues with a child in the family the child has free reign to talk freely to come to the parents and speak openly to their parents without any punishment about sexual issues. The children should feel more comfortable talking to their parents about sex, than their friends. Then their parents need to be educated and intelligent enough to speak kind and loving to their children so they don’t run them off, but let them know that if they have feelings, they cannot act upon them. And the parents should get them involved in the appropriate functions for their gender. And always ask if they have been molested or raped. This is very important to know and is the case a lot of the time. You can never punish someone for feeling something they feel they cannot control. They are confused. They need help. This is a time in history that homosexuality is a fad, too.7 hours ago
- Ben Abrahamson In addition to education, there is (in Judaism) the concept of "guarding the eyes". The concept being that seeing too much can insensitize, or even overload, a persons senses and lead to disgust or revulsion to regular relationships. Has there ever been scientific research to support this claim? I wonder if in 20 years from now we will be aware of the damage of explicit pornography, as today we know the damage of smoking.6 hours ago
- Glenda Faye We have this in Islam as well. I was also taught this in Christianity as well.6 hours ago
- Glenda Faye I don’t know of any studies. I know that thoughts are where this starts and then it goes to the heart. I don’t know if one has to see with the eye to have it go to the thoughts first, however, if one has an imagination.
